Nineteen Months and Counting

Maybe the journey isn’t about becoming anything. Maybe it’s about un-becoming everything that isn’t really you, so you can be who you were meant to be in the first place.

Oprah Quote ForgivenessI’ve been trying to compose this post for three days. I type and then delete all the letters with one long press of the backspace button.

I wish I could say that moving forward is always easy and always driven by the right motivations. In the immediate aftermath of D-Day I trusted no one but myself. Self-reliance became my mantra. I began to believe I would give more love to the world than I would ever receive back in return. I felt like a mouse trapped in a maze with endless tunnels and walls and no real escape. There were some days I just sat down at a dead end and stared endlessly at the walls. Other days when I could keep running through the maze regardless of how many walls I hit. I wasn’t going to stop. There were many moments were I felt there was no escape from my new reality. I was stuck in a maze I never wanted to be in and this was my life. Year one was the maze.

Recently I heard a Boston Marathon survivor say that the days, weeks and months following the bombing felt surreal. On the one year anniversary is when they absorbed the reality of what happened. It must be the same for all traumatic events. The first year after D-Day I was not only in that mouse maze but I was in a haze. I wanted to wake up and find out my husband’s affair was just a horrible nightmare. I am not going to lie, if I woke up tomorrow and found out none of this ever happened I would be ecstatic. A year after D-Day is when you realize the nightmare is real life.

 

So what changes in year two?

I’m a little more than halfway into year two of healing from the affair and I mentioned before that I feel a shift within me. There are elements of the affair that I just don’t care about anymore. I can no longer spend my energy hating Bat Shit. I do hate her (and I always will) but I spend very little time thinking about her. Every time I try to feel sorry for her I don’t. She’s guilty for targeting my husband and feeding him lies to manipulate him. I don’t need to spend my days wishing bad will upon her because I know she invites it in all by herself. When I think about her now I am apathetic.

It took me nineteen months to figure out that my husband didn’t cheat to hurt me or because I was a failing as his wife. He had an affair because it became an option that he didn’t have an answer for at the time. Throughout our marriage we never prepared for infidelity. We never thought it would affect us and that affairs only happen in bad marriages. It bothered me for a long time that he never considered how his affair would affect me. I felt like an afterthought and I probably was an afterthought. Being involved with Bat Shit gave him a high that he didn’t want to admit he needed. I understand what my husband needs now to feel valued, appreciated, adored and desired. I am starting to wonder if just about anyone could become the wayward spouse in the right circumstances. We all have insecurities and desire attention. It feels good to think we are special. It feels good when someone is thinking about you late at night or first thing in the morning. There’s a part of me that understands the appeal my husband felt. He felt important because she needed him and she wrote to him constantly. There’s a part of me that understands. It doesn’t necessarily excuse what happened but it wasn’t about me, it was about him.

I spent so much time grieving for my pre-affair marriage. All the books and therapists told me that my pre-affair marriage was over, accept it and then start new. I went through the grieving process. I blogged about it and I really felt like my marriage had died. After all the pain, tears and struggles I am starting to doubt this theory. My marriage did not end or go on hiatus because of my husband’s affair. Our marriage was not the best it had ever been but it wasn’t terrible either. Obviously, there were cracks in the walls we had built to protect our marriage, but we weren’t in complete ruins. I often look at our lives and wonder how different we were from any other marriage after three children and over ten years.  If you really look at my marriage, it didn’t die or end, it endured.

Letting go. Becoming strong.

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36 thoughts on “Nineteen Months and Counting

  1. Thank you for this post. I feel exactly the same way about my marriage but I’m only 3 months from d day. I grieve for my pre-affair marriage, but I also see it had cracks. I have days when I think I can get through this and other days that I’m sure I won’t survive. I have come to see that the worst part of my marriage was that I lost me. The focus was always on my hsuband and look at what that got me. I have not yet come to accept this was about him and not me. I do understand that in order to move forward, I have to find me. I’m finding that a struggle in itself. The thoughts you share help me so I thank you for taking the time for this.

    • Hi Alison,
      As I go through this process I realize everything is happening for a reason. You have to stop blaming yourself. Since D-Day I realized all my behaviors that allowed the affair to happen/continue but I had to take myself out of the equation. My husband wasn’t thinking about me when he was having his affair–the only time he thought of me was when he wanted to be sure I never found out. Finding myself and trusting that I could love me was hard too. I felt like the affair knocked the wind out of me and made me doubt EVERYTHING. But then I realized this was my opportunity to become whoever I want to be. I can build the marriage I want and tell my husband what I need. It takes courage though after repressing my needs for so long.
      I hope you are doing well tonight. Every marriage has cracks–even good ones. Not one of us is perfect. D-Day is the opportunity to become stronger…

    • Three months is a super tough time. I had to come to realize that I hadn’t established healthy boundaries. I was also waay to much of a caretaker to my husband and that had to stop. I had to find myself, to make me a priority. I hope you can do the same. You are moving in the right direction – it’s a really really good time to be selfish my friend. You have earned it.

  2. Reading this post helped me realize that I need to fully accept that my husband’s affair had nothing to do with me. I’ve told myself that from the beginning, but never fully believed it. It’s painful to think that he really wasn’t thinking much about me during that time, that my significance in his life had dwindled. I believe him when he says he never stopped loving me, but that his love was overshadowed by the attention from the OW. He ended up with her because of his own weaknesses and insecurities, not because of something I did or didn’t do.
    So much of what you write I feel like I could have written myself. It just feels good to read your words and hear my own experiences and emotions in them. It’s validating. I’m almost 13 months out from Dday and I am continually amazed at how much can evolve and change in the course of a year. I have discovered just how strong I can be. We are building the marriage we’ve always wanted, the one we should have had from the beginning.

    • I’m so glad something I wrote resonated with you. As I wrote that post I felt like I was struggling to convey what was in my mind. Just like you, I spent so much time feeling like my husband had chosen his AP over me. The truth is when he was finally told (by me) to make a choice–her or me, he did choose me. And I am guessing your husband did too. But at the time it felt like he was just grasping at straws. Now I see that he truly never saw what he was doing was putting me second when he was in it. Now he sees it but that’s not what his motivations were. It’s hard to look at things through the betrayal goggles… I am so glad to be taking them off and seeing things just as they are. It sounds like you are getting there too and it’s such a good feeling.

  3. It’s true about the grieving. The misconception of my marriage before his affair is just that, a misconception. I thought he was happy. I thought I was giving him what he needed. I thought he was truthful.

    I was wrong. He was wrong (for what he did). We were wrong.

    Now we are trying to be right. It’s a process. A long, winding, painful process but it’s working!

  4. one day while imagine ways to torture OW. A question arose inside my conscience (I refer to as God). This question could not have came from myself. so I will explain how it occurred by referencing it to God. God: if you came upon an accident and a woman whom you don’t recogonize is trapped inside a burning vehicle. You are the only person around. you come closer and realize it to be the OW. Would you if possible help her, no one is around to help her or see you walk away. I paused for a a few seconds. I answered from a different place inside, one I didn’t know even existed. I would absolutely help her. God: then why waste another moment of your life on hating or wishin harm to come to her. It was a major step in my recovery.

  5. I found your blog today and I can’t thank you enough for writing it. It’s been 8 months since my marriage began to fall apart and things are better but “she” is always in the back of my mind. I just want to get past it. Day by day right?

    • Hi,
      At eight months post D-Day I was still plotting my husband’s APs destruction. I wanted her to feel pain like I did/do. At eight months I was still experiencing triggers and there were still a few nights a month I cried myself to sleep. You will get through this… Day by day is right. I wish there was some magic switch that would just propel you right into the “healed” category but it doesn’t seem to work that way. Someone told me I needed to get through the muck before I would see the light at the end of the tunnel. I feel like I fought a war but I am surviving. And that’s something. Thanks you for reading and commenting.

  6. Over two years out from D Day here, and I’ve really appreciated your blog. It can be very lonely keeping all these thoughts to yourself, and seeing that others share the same thoughts is comforting. One thing that is still bothering me, is that I realized recently, that I’m not sure I still feel married. I’m certainly in a relationship with my husband, and he is co parenting more than he ever has, and my life is better than it was before, however, I don’t think I feel the same sense of being married. Maybe it doesn’t matter, but I did really identify with being married and took that sense of commitment seriously. When my husband discussed perhaps wanting to transfer to another city, I found my old sense that ‘we’re married and this is what you do” missing. My thought was would I go, what do I want, and it was unsettling. I’m not sure if that part is broken, and can’t be fixed. Has anyone else felt this way, and how have you dealt with it,and have you been able to find that sense of ‘marriage’ again?

    • Hi,
      I totally get that feeling of not being able to define your “marriage” anymore. Everything I thought was real was not so how could I define our relationship? I knew I loved him and some other women even feel a lack of love as they go through the process. I never felt like my love changed but I know I questioned what marriage meant? You say all these vows but for what? If they can be tossed aside and forgotten so easily? I kept going. I have looked at my marriage since D-Day as–I will see what healing can be done. I [secretly] gave myself two years to feel better. In my head I felt like if I can’t feel hopeful or on the right track in two years then I need to walk away. It hasn’t been until recently, the last two months, that I’ve been feeling like I am not broken, our marriage isn’t broken and I am can have a normal day. I can live my life without thinking about the affair. And when I do think about the affair these days I don’t feel sad, pain or overwhelmed. I feel like–whatever. It’s over. We aren’t that couple anymore. We’ve grown into a new version of ourselves. Just like an IOS system, sometimes you need an upgrade in your marriage too. I know you are further out than I am from D-Day (and I said two years) but what’s your threshold? I gave myself two years because I knew I was going to put everything I could into fixing what was broken. But I know if I had been thrown any curveballs along the way it would have taken me longer to heal. I don’t know if that helps.

      • That’s a great way to phrase it: not being able to define our marriage. I’ll have to spend some time with that thought.

        I didn’t really think about a time frame. In truth I just told him that if he could become my friend, partner, and lover, then I would try, and that therapy had to be part of the equation. Our counselor was surprised by that, but ultimately what would a bunch of demands have gotten me? Either he could become who I needed or he couldn’t. My husband, however, did ask several times that I give him a year to let him prove himself to me, and I don’t think I’ve had that ‘flight’ feeling after the one year mark. Sadly, though, I can say that I still have thoughts about his infidelity everyday. I agree that these thoughts no longer paralyze me, but I certainly wish they could stop. I try to focus on how much better my life is than it had been for years. And it truly is better.

        I guess this is a marathon, not a sprint. I don’t think a timeframe can be set, but you certainly need to feel that you are moving forward and that your husband is in the race with you.

      • I was rethinking about what I wrote the other night to you. I wanted to go back and add to it so I am glad you wrote back!
        I never told my husband that I had a two year time frame in my head. That was something I kept to myself because I felt slightly torn. I felt like I can’t continue to work on a relationship that is causing me pain but I also can’t have one foot out the door if I am trying to fix things. So in the back of my head I made a silent agreement with myself that if I was still in pain and struggling after two years time then I would reassess. But yet, as I write that I also realize that there will always be times when I struggle with the affair. I may be fine today but that doesn’t mean that tomorrow won’t be difficult. I remember telling my husband that if in ten years I was upset about the affair he needed to be there and support me. I never want to hear from him that he expected me to be over it by now. I promise not to throw it in his face but he needs to not think this didn’t hurt me to my core.
        I don’t think you can put a timeframe on healing either. Thanks for writing back.

    • I am right there with you – 10 and a half months here. I was looking at him just today and thought, “Although it’s not horrible right now, it’s different. I need help to redefine “love” because I am so conscious that CHOOSING love is actually a daily choice – and I’d like it at some point to be not so hard to make that choice.”

      Yes, he has been trying. Yes he expresses his love for me (although honestly the words while good to hear do not do anything for me). Yes he’s handsome.

      Rarely do I look at him and think, “He’s mine! I’m so happy I’m in this marriage.”

      It feels guilty. I know I’m doing the right thing by staying. But coming clean with that truth feels guilty – I’d never admit that to someone in real life.

      • Oh those three little words! It does feel nice when he says I love you, but you’re right the words have been tarnished. He was willing to say them when he didn’t mean it, so their value is diminished.
        What’s more upsetting to me, though, is my difficulty in saying them to him. I have no difficulty showing him that I love him or feeling love for him, but the words just don’t fly out of my mouth. I hear myself say it to our children and close friends, but not to my husband. I need to make an intention to say them each day until it becomes more natural. It’s interesting that I don’t recall having this problem after Dday. It seems to have developed over time. Is this a result of trickle truth, or just my mind getting stuck? Who knows.

  7. Recently, I’ve been reading more about healing & grieving. How a broken heart, is an open heart. Cracks let the light in . . .

    I know the affair never defined me, as a person. Now, I’m ready to not let it define my marriage. I choose to concentrate on positive memories, without denying the history.

    Everyone grieves differently and grief is universal. (Boston Marathon)

    The combination of positively changing my thoughts, living in the present moment & sending love to someone when I remember how I’ve been hurt, reminds me to love myself and that I am worthy of love.

  8. 21 years into Marriage, he cheats, an. Office Affair. one month before he retired, and after I had decided to lay that aSide, the summer before , I found he cheated on her for 2 years…… Here I am now, a beautiful, sexual, 64 yr old women crying most nights with my husband that I sent to the other room. I will not sleep with a man whore that I loved so many years and my best friend.
    when I was much younger, I raised two girls by myself for 6 years after I
    divorced their dad.. I made it on my own and so will you. do not wait until it’s too late, unless you are independently wealthy!!! at my aGE now, middle class family, wife, etc

    so perfect for me. I’m truly blessed with children grandchildren and great-grandchildren. sweet sisters out there do not think that with this kind of stuff

  9. I am so blessed by this blog!! My Love relentlessly asks me why I insist on reading a blog which journeys through divorce and reconciliation. I keep telling him that being informed is one of the biggest life tasks I must complete on daily basis…I try to help him understand that your blog has prepared me. I am prepared to forgive, prepared to love him unconditionally and definitely prepared to make self-check and relationship checks a constant habit for us!! Don’t get me wrong, I am not going into our relationship anticipating that he will cheat; however I think it’s a disservice to me to pretend that this may be never be my reality, one day. God has a way of leading us into the path of knowledge. I am so glad your blog is one of the gems I collected as I journey through. Thank you for sharing your story!! My Love and I will be married this summer. Please pray for us, as a matter of fact, I would love it if you and your husband prayed for us-together!! Tell your husband I said thank you as well. I respect him deeply!! Be Blessed and keep writing!!!

  10. thank you for this wonderful post and all the responses…I too remember reading how I had to mourn and let go of my “old” marriage…I have struggled with that for sometime…why should I/we? yes this affair has now left it’s mark but wait a minute so did giving birth to 3 beautiful kids…burying our parents and beloved animals…taking some very fun and memorable vacations…I am not going to mourn any of that…it happened…marriage is an adventure…oh hell yes it took a turn I/we NEVER anticipated but we will emerge on the other side slightly wounded but knowing the love never really died…

  11. July 12, 2014 will be the second anniversary of D-Day. I have learned alot about myself, my marriage, my family and my husband. The first year was spent overcoming the hurt and the anger towards my husband and the OW. Angry that I never had a say about the changes that have occurred as a consequence of their stupidity. Each day was a comparison to the life I lived a year earlier, before D-Day. In counseling I explained to my husband I needed him to be accountable for his contribution to creating and maintaining the relationship with the OW. It was clear he couldn’t do it as he continued to give me vague answers. Inferring the relationship became romantic only after he was fired for it being ‘inappropriate relationship’ and moved in with the OW because he had no where else to go. Lucky me. The OW is fond of sharing her life on her public facebook page.

    As I round the corner on the second anniversary I have spent this year feeling as though my thoughts are out of control. As a result I could sabotage our efforts to heal our marriage by the constant flashbacks and comparisons as I look for security that my husband will not “drift” again. My husband has made alot of changes in himself as a father, husband and son. He is becoming frustrated with my ongoing need for reassurance. He has never explained why it all happened and that worries me. Does he know why? If he doesn’t how will it not happen again?

    I don’t want this to define me or our marriage. My ‘scars’ are still raw and constant reminders of how I can misjudge a situation.

    • Hi Jennifer,
      I can relate to much of what you are saying. I know that my constant need for reassurance is draining to me. My husband understands but I want to be able to just trust again without thought. Sometimes I fear the more we heal, the more normal we become again. Feeling normal doesn’t feel safe anymore. I felt normal during most of my husband’s affair period and then it led to me feeling insecure. Triggers linger in the most unlikely places.

      • that is how I feel when things feel normal I always think something is wrong and I feel sad for letting myself feel normal because it could lead to how the affair started in the first place

      • Feeling normal triggers fear in me. Because as you said it felt normal when the affair was happening. Rather than allow myself to be brought down by these feelings I’m trying to refocus my thoughts in hopes that my feelings will follow. It’s not real easy. I’ve been told to think of the good things that have resulted. Even that doesn’t do much on the difficult days. Last February I inadvertently found an email between my husband and OW. He admitted to intermittent contact with her but once again I feel he was lying. I fear that I will be taken advantage of. How do I redefine marriage? How do I NOT let fear control me? Triggers do lie in the most unexpected places. How do I learn to trust without fear of being wrong in my judgement?

      • Feeling normal doesn’t feel entirely “safe” for me either. For the most part I want to be normal but my knowledge of the affair has redefined everything. I think accepting that all of this is part of the new normal is another trigger.

  12. tomorrow is D day for me the day after Mother’s Day I also grieved pre affair marriage then one day it hint me if we were so fantastic at the whole marriage thing why did he have an affair so from that day on I’ve thought not so much on what we had in marriage but what we could do now don’t get me wrong it is a long emotional rd and still is but for me I’m glad I walked this path I had to walk it regardless it happened and there was no turning back we chose to stay together and make things work I wouldn’t have never found out what we really mean to each other and how being ourself is ok some days I get up and wonder am I gunna make it though and then I see my thoughts about the OW are less and less every week so prosgress is good. I was wondering how am I gunna survive tomorrow I’m thinking it’s just another day to be thankful that I have my family and friends in my life and that we both stuck it out though those bad times because we so many good times ahead 😃 if that all makes sense

  13. I very much identify with what you have written, Julesedison and Verumistruth! I also feel guilty for feeling the way I feel.
    Memorial Day weekend was my 1 year anti-versary. On that weekend in 2013 I would find out that my husband was having a full blown affair with a co worker. That weekend he was would let me know that he had also had an affair while we were engaged. He had had emotional affairs that involved making out with 3 other women (all co-workers) while we were married. (one I knew about , that was 7 yrs ago and through LOTS of counseling, we had worked through it- ish. Scars are scars.)
    In September he would be diagnosed as Manic Bipolar and proscribed lithium (which is working great). He continues to go to counseling once a week and takes his meds. Last year he continued to lie and omit truths until Nov. when I cut him off sexually because he continued to show me he wasn’t trust worthy and I could not share my body with a liar. He is a great father (we have 3 children). He is a better father than he ever was. He dotes on me, which he always did, but he does even more so. He always tells me he loves me, I cannot say those words. I care for him. He is nicer to me than ever, less argumentative, no longer condescending. He doesn’t pick fights over stupid stuff anymore. I just don’t love him. He kisses my face, I cannot kiss his lips. It feels like kissing a friend or cousin. We are co-habituating. I don’t know if I have anything more in me or want more. I feel so bad writing any of this. His hyper sexuality and narcissism due to his Bipolar has laid waste to so much. We had a fun sex life before. We were very attracted to each other before. We were fun! We had friends over and were at dinner parties all the time. People thought we were a great couple and team. We still are a great team, actually a better team than before, but the couple thing…..We go on dates, he wants us to have a great marriage, he is holding on to hope that we can make it, I feel dead inside when it comes to him. I often think there may be too much water under this bridge. My counselor says people with bipolar, when they take their meds and receive therapy do a 180 in their personality. There is great hope that he is a changed person. There has just been so much damage done……

    • What a relief to know I am not the only one who has the same feelings you describe. I care for my husband, but not sure I can still love him after finding out about his 8 1/2 year emotional and physical affair (they both swear it was not sexual, but could only have been a matter of time before it got to that too). It is as if a terribly loud crash has taken away my hearing, but it has also taken away my ability to feel anything for him. I’m almost 6 months out from D-Day. He is remorseful and swears he has only ever loved me for the past 29 years, but I can’t seem to make myself believe it. He is not bipolar, but as the adult child of an alcoholic he has his own issues he has not dealt with. We had a great sex life and now I’m not even missing touching him. I think I’m still in shock! It’s all I can do to take care of myself, our wonderful 2 children and work full-time (insult to injury – I’ve been the primary breadwinner who enabled him to pursue his hobbies…one of which turned out to be the disreputable naturopathic “doctor” who became his AP). Does the feeling of love come back? I am just numb from the trauma and time will heal my lack of feelings for him? I know I loved him before…am I like a person with amnesia who just can’t remember I love him??

  14. It was really interesting g to see how you all came out of this feeling of being cheated. I am new to this found out few days ago about my husbands affair. I have been married to him for 14 years 4 kids. I don’t know how I am feeling I am so confused. He say he is sorry and he done biggest mistake of his life. He never wish to loose his family me and kids. Why did he took that risk than by going to another women. One min I feel I should get over this, he is my husband he is willing to change and be with me but I am scared he mite do that again. I am in so much pain at this stage I don’t know how to explain. I asked him to to me time and space to find my self. I don’t even know if I can love him or he loves me even though he says he does love me alot. I am not sure of anything any more. I can’t sleep at night I haven’t eaten properly in last few days. Why I am feeling this way he is the one who done wrong in our marriage why I feel this way?

    • You are just in the beginning stages of finding out about your husband’s affair. I found it impossible to know what I wanted or could trust in the first few months after D-Day. I doubted everything and it took months for my husband to prove to me he was trustworthy again. Unfortunately it takes time. You know you can trust yourself so take care of yourself. I found it hard to eat too but slowly my appetite returned over time. Just be sure to eat the minimum your body needs and drink water. If you cannot sleep you can drink tea that helps you rest or take an OTC sleeping med. Just be careful.
      The roller coaster of emotions is normal too. As time goes on you will find the roller coaster will lessen but it takes some effort. Keep talking and make sure you express what you are going through to your husband too.

      • Thank you for your replay. Each day is getting hard. Because my husband is not willing to give me space to think and get over it. He is contacting my mum to pressure me not to leave him. He is harassing me all the time he say he is scared of losing me. He don’t want to talk about his affair but expect me to get over it without questioning him. I can’t stop thinking about it.

      • It sounds like he wants to be in control and relationships are a two-way street. It could be he needs that control or it could be he doesn’t want to accept his actions could have destroyed you and/or your marriage. I would figure out what you need if you were to try to rebuild your marriage (if that’s what you want). Write those absolutes down and then write down a list of things you would like to improve in your marriage if you could. Either send the list to your husband or talk to him. He needs to understand what you need for you to trust him again.

  15. This post really hit home as many of your other posts have. I am 5.5 months out from d day 1 and 1 month out from d day 2. I struggle with this thought of your first marriage is dead. I guess to me I feel like then let’s get a divorce. I tried so hard over the 10 years my husband had two affairs. He always turned it on me. Why was I so needy, sick, nagging, unhappy??? On and on. I am having a hard time dealing with myself. I think how could I have listened to him and followed his orders. He told me not to call him at work since he was so busy. He went on any and all vacations with friends. Many others too. How could I have tolerated and listened to him. Granted I was lied to. I think we had happy times too. But I wonder how often his thoughts were of these women, texting, calling, emailing, following them on fb? It is hard for me to reconcile and understand. It is hard for me to feel safe and have comfort. I am troubled he kept so much from me on the first d day. I am troubled that he leaned to despise me. I get why so he did not feel as guilty. So some days I am like how can this work. Other days I am like I deserve a medal for enduring. But there is too much good and no guarantees with anyone else either.
    I also struggle since he just seems to be saying and doing the right things. He has been amazing. Can this last is this our new norm. Can he really keep appropriate boundaries in place? We have redefined our marriage. It is really good. We had a great 20th anniversary. And I did not think that could be possible.

    One thing I said to him is I find it so hard that I am so affected by something I had zero input and yet he and the two ow did. He said he wishes he was not on that side of the table and he hates himself for that. He takes responsibility but he is not happy about it. He finally said the other night he is actually starting to like himself again. I thought that was a big deal.

    How do you allow vulnerability again? I cannot control him and he could have chances to have contact with the 2 ow or others. I am not going to keep him locked up. How do I feel like we are committed? I should explain both affairs were sporadic. He would go a year without talking to one only saw her three times in person and not for the past 6 years. The other me met 10 years ago but nothing happened for 3 years and then for 5 years. He has had no physical contact for almost 2 years and not talking etc for 18 months. Again sporadic with her. He said he never planned on or never wanted to leave me. He said we got married so young and felt like he did not get to play the field so that we it. No sharing his life or future plans but to go on with two women one for 10 years and the other for 5.5 or so. Ugh I don’t know sigh…

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